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Property Management Mastermind Show

#148: Brad Larsen Gets On His Soapbox

Aug 04, 2022 by Brad Larsen

Pay attention! Brad has a few things he needs to get off his chest! From the current state of the industry to best practices, lawsuits that could impact realtor commissions to handling the headache that is churn, this episode features a rant of sorts, but a rant that you need to hear! Could the real estate industry be on the verge of a major shift? Is there a “scheme” when it comes to leasing and realtors branching off on their own? Grab the popcorn and listen as Brad gets on his soapbox!

Learn more about RentWerx at www.rentwerx.com!

BRAD: Hey, everybody. On today's episode, it's soapbox time. I'm going to be jumping on and talking about all kinds of things, getting things off my chest, and it's going to be a good therapy for everybody. So you got to listen in.

ANNCR: Welcome to the Property Management Mastermind Show with your host, Brad Larson. Brad owns one of the fastest growing property management companies in San Antonio, Texas. This podcast is for property managers. By property managers, you'll hear from industry leading professionals on best practices, new ideas, success stories and lessons learned. This is your opportunity to learn about the latest industry buzz surrounding property management, as well as tips and strategies to improve your business.

ANNCR: Property meld is a smart maintenance coordination solution proven to turn maintenance headaches into profitability. Our Maintenance Coordination Hub connects all property management companies, key players in one location, providing maintenance, oversight and efficiency to property management maintenance teams. Our solution streamlines communication throughout the coordination process, resulting in the oversight and efficiency property managers need to create a profitable maintenance operation. Property MELD delivers property managers with a positive maintenance experience. Check out more information at Property MEDCOM or reach out at info at Property MEDCOM. Find digs, make sure leasing process lightning fast and 100% fraud proof straight from the applicant's phone findings not only instantly verifies income by connecting directly to bank accounts without any documents uploaded, but also uses 3D selfies and facial match technology to perform complete fraud proof bank grade identity verification, allowing property managers to process applications in under an hour. For more information, check out their website at WW. Find Dexcom or reach out to Henson at Henson at Fine Diggs.

BRAD: Welcome, everybody, to another edition of a property management mastermind show. I'm your host, Brad Larson. And today, I have a super awesome, fantastic. Never before seen ever the most greatest thing ever. Awesome guest. And, well, it's me. Ha ha ha. Today's. I'm just going to do a monologue. It's just today's episode. We're going to do a monologue. I'm going to get on my soapbox. I'm going to rant a little bit. I'm going to talk about a few best practices. I'm going to talk about the state of the industry. It's just a few things I wanted to throw out there for conversation. So to kick this off, I want to talk about what's going on with the the National Association of Realtors. And they are in this class action lawsuit where in a nutshell, they're being alleged that there are some antitrust violations going on in buyers agency, in real estate sales. And so the realtors are starting to react to this, as anybody would, because this is this is potentially going to inflict some damage on their commission potential. And so we're seeing something called commission compression already. And if you don't understand a lot of that, let me kind of back up just a hair, because what's going on is the feds are alleging that NPR is practicing antitrust because of the 3%, X percent, 10% buyer's agency commission, which typically buyers have no control of, because in a real estate transaction, the sale is the sales commission is actually going through the listing agent, the selling agent, and that could be 5%, 6%.

BRAD: I'm just speaking common and customary terms. And so for too long it's been a common and customary 6%. And for too long it's been a common and customary 3% to the buyer's agent, which if you allege an antitrust violation, well, there it is. It's a fixed cost that no one can control the consumer. The buyer can't control it. And I'm not saying it's right or wrong. I'm just saying this is what's going on. And I'm going to talk about some of the ramifications for the property management industry as we get going. But right now, that case is mid-stream. And already in Washington state, the Washington state entity that could be Washington, whoever, whoever's making those decisions, they're already starting to put new forms into place that could potentially eliminate buyers agency commissions. Right. Because if an agent goes to a buyer and says, hey, do you want to pay me a commission? Most buyers and a good chunk of them will say, no, I'll just go straight to the home on the website and buy the home that I want or work with that listing agent to help me bid for the home. And so buyer's agency has lost a little bit of its value and consumers are starting to recognize that and they're starting to react to that now, kind of trying to fill you guys in a little bit. But the end of the day, it does mean something because imagine if you have 20 to 30% of the buyer's agents out there that all of a sudden their their income cuts down to 10%.

BRAD: I mean, they literally lose everything overnight with one court decision. Now, all of a sudden, where are they going to go? They're going to go towards property management. They're going to go towards leasing because a lot of the states have created a minimal if zero barrier of entry, a zero qualification standard to run property management. There are certain states out there that don't even require a real estate license, which baffles me to no end. I don't get it. I don't understand it. I don't agree with it. But there are states out there that do that for whatever reason. They're like, Yeah, go ahead and be a property management person where you're collecting rents, you're distributing rents, you're a money manager, you're managing millions in trust accounts and you don't need a license. Yeah, it makes perfect sense to me. It really doesn't to me. And so this is part of the the problem that we see is Nahum has not been able to align themselves with the NAR for whatever reason. My theory is that because Nahum does not require all of the licensee, all of the members to be licensees. And so you have states like Idaho do not require a license and they don't want to turn away them, those potential members, to become part of NORTHAM.

BRAD: And so since NORTHAM allows non licensed members and they are will not align themselves with NORTHAM, which means we don't have any say in that fight, which means we don't have the near the lobbying effort that NPR has. Now, I know people are screaming at me right now saying NPR is the worst thing ever, blah, blah, blah. Here's why. Probably right. But all I know is we're not getting anywhere with our 5000, 6000 members in NORTHAM to where it's contributing anything to the national landscape. As far as the lobbying efforts, as far as the legal efforts like legislation, for example, I know we have some lobbyists, but we need one in every state. And that's part of what's going on, is the education is just necessarily not there. The legislation to push for more education is not there, meaning that we don't have the level of standard that we need because all of a sudden we're going to have a ton of agents turn to property management, they're going to turn to leasing as their next alternative. And all of a sudden we're going to start seeing major consumers getting hurt, major owners getting hurt, and it's not good. So I made a Facebook post about this the other day and some few comments. We came in and they're pretty solid. One, for example, is, yes, we need to educate these leasing agents more. I say absolutely 100%. That could be part of the requirement. So, for example, there's two designations already in Texas, the TLS, the TRP and their three, four day long courses each.

BRAD: And you have to have one before you have the other. So essentially, you're looking at roughly 80 hours, of course, instruction to go through the entire management leasing cycle of owning a management company, how it works, how lease agreements work, how trust accounts work, I mean, the entire thing and that should be easily implemented as far as that's your licensing requirement. So if you're going to be a property manager in Texas to have a property manager designation, to have a property manager license that could easily implement that into place, to say you must take the TLS on to your RPM courses, get qualified in each of those PASOS courses, and then you can do leasing, then you can do property management. That would be the easy fix because I do think it's going to happen where we see a lot of agents come into the market. The leasing side is infuriating because any real estate agent can basically lease a home. They can put it on the multiple listing service for lease, they can draft a lease on a napkin. Their broker may not even know what they're doing behind their back, and they're practicing property management, which is most likely outside of their insurance scope. Most brokers have some sort of professional liability and or errors or omissions assurance insurance, potentially even some general liability insurance. But it may not have the property management designation.

BRAD: It may not it may exclude property management. So if you have agents out there doing property management and the broker gets into a lawsuit, the broker could be tied to where they have no coverage. That's really bad stuff. So anyway, that's that's part of what I want to make you aware of as a listeners. That's what's going on with this new legislation with NPR. We talked about it at conferences. We made some posts about it. It's it's been a hot topic, but now all of a sudden, because of this new Washington rule that just came into effect this week, it's here. So it's coming. I think that goes into effect, I think, in October, 1st of October. And so you're going to be seeing it more and more. We'll start to get some information from some of the people that are in Washington state to see what effect this has. But how it affects property management companies is really simple. Imagine all of a sudden you have 20 more competitors, 200 more competitors in your market trying to take some of your market share. That's a scary thought. So just want to bring that to your attention. Now, moving on, I do want to talk about one of the things that I've seen on some heard on some podcasts. I've seen on a few posts out there. There was a conversation just the other day on a podcast and they were talking about a partner. And so what I wanted to bring up was partnerships and having partners.

BRAD: Now I'm in business with several partners. As far as other ventures, I'm doing okay. I get it. In my experience, I have to help be the lead for that before I can really adjust it and accept it, because I'm just that way. I'm just that personality. But where I'm going with this I wanted to bring up the partnerships is if you're in a partnership now and your partner is dead weight, meaning they're not contributing to your business, I would say get out of that. If that partnership is a dead weight partnership, it's not doing you any favors. You need to go to that dead weight partner, buy them out, get them out of the business somehow. Because if you continue on in a growth model, you're dragging that dead weight behind you. And so if you want to exit, you're going to look back years from then and say, Wow, I know I have to I have to pay off this dead weight partner. I hear a lot of property management companies start these businesses. They have a partner who doesn't do anything in the business. They. Might be an insurance, they might be in construction and they start this property management business and they build it up to a good revenue, two or three or 4 million in revenue, but yet they still have this dead weight partner who's collecting half of the proceeds or whatever the percentage point is.

BRAD: And to me, I think that's that's crazy. And I think that's that's something you should address in your own business, because if you have one of those partnerships, get out of it. Go get an SBA loan, buy that partner out, work some terms come to a finite agreement to where you can get that dead weight out of your business. It's never going to help you, and it's just going to cause you more animosity towards that partner. And in the end of the day, it's just a time suck in a life suck out of your business. So the deadweight partnerships, I got to tell you, you know, me standing on my soapbox is get out of that situation as soon as you can. Bite the bullet, rip the Band-Aid off, get out of it and get going forward. As an individual owner, if you can or sell the business, turn around and sell. And that's another way out as well. Okay. I want to bring that up to. All right. Now, I heard this on the other day. Again, this is me ranting. This is soapbox level. I've talked about this a lot is heard this the other day that a well known management company didn't have a brokerage. And I see this all the time. They don't have a real estate sales brokerage. So here in the beginning of the podcast, I'm railing about buyer's agency, but yet I'm recommending to all property management companies to have a real estate brokerage.

BRAD: And there's just a thousand reasons for it to include increasing your revenue, increasing your control and being full service. Right. That's part of it. Provide exceptional service. This is what you do as a property management company. And so one point in particular. This particular episode was going on and the property management company owner, somebody wanted to sell the property. They referred it to some partner company where they get a referral fee, what, 30 to 40%, but yet they took that home and sold it on the open market to most likely a primary resident. You see everything there missing that. I see it, but maybe they don't. And maybe they need to be shaken a little bit. But take that home that that seller wants to sell. Sell that home yourself as your own real estate brokerage. Sell it to one of your investors and keep that home under management. You see where I'm going with that? You made a commission on the sale and you keep that home under management long term. That's how you reduce churn, which I'm going to go into it a little bit, but that's a big part of it. Get in touch with your own brokerage. If you're outsourcing, stop it. Get a real estate brokers license. Hire a real estate broker, hire an agent, figure it out. But you've got to have a brokerage in your own company for that one particular reason I just mentioned, not to mention all the sales that are leaving you, all the all the opportunities you're missing for pocket listings, all the opportunities you're missing to go to your investors, go to your owners and say, hey, I can help you buy five properties or ten properties, right? It's not just selling, it's buying as well.

BRAD: Those opportunities are all right there in front of you. And let's not forget the tenants, right? The tenants that you're placing in the properties, those tenants want to buy homes. Your company should be there to help facilitate that transaction again. Why? Because that tenant says, I'm going to buy a home. Great. Let us help you. You can control the transaction. You can control the timing. You can control the the early termination. And you can go to the owner and say, yes, Mr. Owner, instead of them vacating with a 30 day notice with with in the middle of November, they're leaving in the springtime when we help them buy another home. And there might be a little bit of flux here or there, but this allows us to provide you with the least amount of vacancy because we are controlling that purchase. And so a big part of it, again, is providing exceptional service and a part of that is owning a real estate brokerage. So if you don't get into it, don't be fearful. It's not going to bite you. It's a great business. Again, you need to have that as part of your of your property management umbrella is to have a real estate brokerage.

BRAD: Okay, good stuff there. Now that leads me into the discussion of churn. I've had a few irritating burrs in my saddle over the churn after a bit, because I'm seeing all kinds of vendors who've never managed a single property telling us how to stop churn. And it drives me insane. I get they're trying to do the right thing. They're trying to help property management company owners. They're telling you that if you send out a quarterly email, all is going to be okay and you can cut your churn in half. Well, it's not that simple. And so I just I want to make sure that these vendors understand that they never will understand they'll never understand churn until you sit inside the seat of a property manager, until you've had that conversation with an owner who doesn't want to make a repair. You've had that conversation with the owner who doesn't want to rent to that certain class of people over there. You've had that conversation with owners that are maddening where they're calling your staff and wearing you out that that ten or 20% of those owners that drive you insane, either you are waiting to fire them or you can't wait for them to fire you. Now, of course, churn is also sales, right? Did I not just touch on that with sales? I mean, think about it. If you're wanting to reduce churn, why are you listening to a vendor who doesn't even understand what a real estate brokerage is or how to open one? Don't listen to them.

BRAD: Go and talk to somebody who knows about real estate brokerage sales. That's your number one churn right now is sales. Stop the sales. You will reduce the churn. Yes, I get it. It's a customer service business. I know there's going to be vendors that are mad at me because I'm a little irritated at the whole churn concept with these vendors in our space because they seem to act like they're the experts and they're not because they've not done what you and I have done and run. A property management company did not have those tough conversations with owners. They hear about it through the grapevine. They nod their head that they understand, but they don't. Okay. Other ways to reduce churn. There's 1000 ways to reduce churn. It's good communication. It's a campaign. It's not just one thing here. One thing. They're one great example I stole from Brad Randall at the PPM conference 2022 is Brad Randall put on a great presentation about doing owner webinars. They do quarterly owner webinars. In fact, we have our first one starting today. So there you go. I listened to our peers in the business, found out what's actually. Working in their business and I'm applying it to our business here at Works, and that's going to be the first quarterly webinar we're doing today about maintenance. Maintenance is another one that causes churn y, because when you're not doing maintenance at a high level, the owners get mad at you and fire you.

BRAD: Or if you're not getting bids correctly or if you're not doing things in a timely manner, or if you're charging too much or too little, that causes churn. And so we're addressing that with our owners today and our webinar talking about maintenance, the maintenance discussions points that are all going to happen, how challenging it is right now with inflation, with COVID, with parts, with 105 degree heat in San Antonio, in Texas right now, it's crazy hot. And so all these challenges we're going to talk about today and how it's going to help potentially reduce churn. So there you go. There's another technique I've talked about a lot I want to bring it up to our attention is I think there is a lot of things that we could do to reduce churn. And I talked about it doing good maintenance, solid communication sales, gang sales. That's that's so big. I mean, if you were to keep track of your churn in a good, neutral, bad format like we do, we track our losses and good a good could be we sold their home neutral could be they move back in or then or a referral sold it back they sold their home for example a bad is we fire them they fire us, right? We track all that and we look at it every year and we're like, okay, how do we reduce some of this? And it's never just a cut and dry argument because it's a part of a campaign.

BRAD: And so, again, I go back to it is I want you to be aware that to get into and to cure the churn or to reduce the churn, slow the churn. It's a campaign of 100 different things. It's not one magic bullet. And you have to understand where it's happening in your business, all stemming from good metrics, good tracking. Another good way to do this is having exit surveys. So if you do lose an owner, contact the owner. So what's going on? Why did you leave? Well, you know, nobody called me back or nobody returned my email or, you know, you just charge too much. We'll find out what's going on with them and make sure somebody else is doing the phone call, not the property manager that lost the business because they're going to tell you what you want to hear, but go to somebody and maybe even use a third party to contact them. Maybe you, the business owner, maybe an alternate person in the office calls them, maybe you hire a remote team member to call, I mean, all kinds of ideas, but have somebody different call an outgoing tenant or excuse me, an outgoing owner and ask as to why they're leaving the business. It could it could be painful. Right. The other part is watch your reviews. If you get reviews that are one star and you get the owners that say they hate you because this, that and the other, well, are they making a point? Is nobody calling them back? Is nobody answering emails.

BRAD: That could be something that you may have to reflect. And we're done and say, well, we maybe we might need to get better at that. Right? Maybe nod your head and say, okay, you could be right and we have to we have to get better. And so that's a big part of it and moving on from there. A couple other things I want to talk about is there's there's self insuring with the preferred tenant program that was brought up the other day. And the preferred tenant program is something that we've implemented three plus years ago. There's lots of vendors out there now that will help back you up. They have surety bonds. They have programs. A good one's obligor, another good one's resident insurance services. Are is those types of companies out there are fantastic to try to get into a preferred tenant program which is by the way where you take a monthly fee in lieu of a security deposit. So instead of advertising for let's say you want to rent a home at 5000 dollars, you advertise for the rent at 5000 and a security deposit at 1500. Right? The old standby, one month's rent or even two month's rent. Well, you give them the option. Let's say you can come in and pay x, x, whatever that could be.

BRAD: In your leasing scheme. You pay a small monthly fee, which is a fee. It's gone, it's a fee, it's not a non refundable deposit. Which is hilarious how we get managers even in this market. I rented four homes from a big name property management company here in this market who charge me a non-refundable deposit and hello proper English. The English of that means that a non refundable deposit is a fee. So call it a fee. All right, that's another tangent of mine. But so anyway, the preferred tenant program, monthly fee is gone, goes to the manager. That's in lieu of a large security deposit. And that large security deposit is just full of landmines. This is full of legal peril that you can get into. If you don't do this correctly. If you don't do that correctly, you're facing trouble, damages. Your fake is facing attorneys fees. It's just it's just a nightmare. And so what we're seeing is more and more companies doing a small monthly fee in lieu of a security deposit, and the tenants are now starting to expect it. Where I'm going with that is there is some conversation about self insuring, and that is a little bit of scary thing because if you are offering a monthly fee and giving your owners a guarantee without any sort of insurance involved, you could be acting as an insurance company. Right. So talk to an attorney about this, review some of your local market ideas.

BRAD: I'm not saying you're wrong. I'm not saying you're right. I'm just saying it's a little bit nervous. We've adjusted fire on our preferred tenant program several times to where we're doing things a little bit differently with different vendors. And that way we are in full compliance with the new Texas Property Code 92.111, which is written about as clear as mud. And so the idiots at the state that wrote that, it's it's baffling. I mean, I've had three attorneys look at it and they all gave me three different opinions and none of it is clear. And then a new form comes out that says the exact opposite of what the property code says. So don't even get me started on that. That was a a Texas form that came out and said the exact opposite of what the Texas Property Code says. And I can show you that in writing and you can read it for yourself. But it's again, this is where I would love to see more involvement, to help try and lobby at the state level for every state. I think every state should have a state lobbyist that can go and put those property management concerns in front of the lawmakers and address this as far as, hey, did you realize that you issued a form, a state promulgated form that is in direct basically it contradicts directly the state property code. Well, we didn't know that. Blah, blah, blah. Exactly. So those things need to be brought to their attention and it's a frustrating thing at some point.

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BRAD: All right. The last thing I want to talk about is business development training. This has been kind of a hot topic around. You see lots of vendors coming into the space. And I want to comment on that because I have some pretty good personal experience on this. So years back, I hired a gentleman named Bryan Hughes and he was the business development person for Rent Works and he did that for three years for us and he absolutely killed it. At certain points, he was signing up roughly one home every calendar day. And so that's quite a bit. You're signing up three or 400 homes a year, and he did that for three years. Now, naturally, the churn you get sales, you get losses, all kinds of stuff that you know is never as easy as you think to to grow a management company because of all the constant flux. Right. And that's that's the part of it. It's just part we have to accept. If it was an apartment complex and you handed me 600 homes, you know, we can handle it to the to absolute perfection because there's never any up or down on the unit count, which means you never have to deviate from your staffing design, which makes it so much easier to manage. But in a property management company, third party where you're managing single family homes, there is constant change because of potential constant growth or even shrinkage to where you're hiring, firing staff and all this other stuff. Staff come, staff go. It's never as easy. So back to the business development side.

BRAD: So Bryan Hughes started the biz dev mastermind and so I stayed course Bryan. I got him going on this concept and he created the biz dev mastermind and that's been a fantastic, absolute awesome service that he has providing. And I've hired him now twice. He hired Will in my office in San Antonio, and he just hired a new lady that's going to start next week for our business development person in Austin and they hit Bryan and Stephanie have both done all that. They basically did it from from start to finish. They can hire that business development person, but obviously they have to advertise for that business about biz dev person. They have to screen that biz dev person, they have to interview, they have to put them in front of the decision maker. That could be you or your PT staff. You have to interview them and then they actually help you with the the agreements, the employment agreements, the compensation structure, the commissions, etc. and then they help with the training and implementation along with the lead flow, not to mention the design of the entire business with a business development review. Because if you're charging 50% management fees per month, $500 a door for a $500 unit, no one's going to hire you. So that's the kind of service that can come in and actually look at your business and recommend potential changes. Now I want to bring it up because there are other services out there, right. And I think you should shop them.

BRAD: But I wanted to give Brian and Stephanie a shout out because they're doing a fantastic job. So not only did I start Brian in the beginning, I'm still eating my own dog food, let's say. And I've hired him twice now as a business development consultant to come into our business and help set up biz dev for us. Because if someone leaves, you have to start over, right? The processes could be there, the procedures could be there, the the methods, the lead count. But the person that's actually going out to the properties to physically meet with the owners and sign up properties that needs to be highly skilled. And that's where you can go find somebody is Brian Hughes, biz dev mastermind. So just want to give a quick little shout out to Brian. So one more thing I want to add is a discussion on software and we're seeing lots of software's out there. People always talk about the big four and so I'm not going to name them. I've used two of those Big Four before. And so now it's it's it's kind of like they're all they're all equally maddening and they're all equally good. However, we switched to rent buying this was about this was November of last year. So we've been running on rent right now for eight months plus being extremely happy with rent buying. We recommend them to anybody who asks that. That is the actual best software out on the market for nothing else. The customer support. You know, there have been several stories about Folio, for example, to where someone who's left out Folio and wanted to work with rent buying, they're getting threatening emails and getting their service potentially turned off by a folio.

BRAD: And that's that's happening, you know, through the industry. And it's very maddening because these management software companies have gotten so big that they don't care about us. The little guys that are part of Na Boom that manage single family homes, they just want the big players. They want the companies that manage 50,000 homes versus 500. And so their customer service has waned and they've built it up. They went public and everyone at the top got paid. But they're still the little guy is only getting a little bit of it and the customer service is going. On Hill. So I've been really happy with rent. Mine rent works have been very happy with rent buying and we continue to beat the drum because I feel they're only going to continue to get better. They're adding more and more services on a weekly, monthly basis, and it's just a solid team over there that provides good customer support, great customer support to us, and they understand us and they're in business for us. So I just want to give you a quick plug on that and give you our experience. All the reporting is there, all the metrics are there, all the features are there, you name it, they have it. I would recommend you get into a demo and check it out and look at the rent line as well. So in closing, I wanted to say, hey, thanks for listening to me on the soapbox today.

BRAD: It's one of those where just got into a mood and I want to get out there a few things off my chest and and just put out some things that are going on in the industry. Here we are in late July of 2022. The recession is looming. We have an election coming up in November. Gas prices are through the roof. Inflation is through the roof already keeping up with it? I hope so. I hope your unit count's going to go potentially up. Keep in mind, if we have a recession, less people are going to be selling, more people are going to be renting. That might help you actually build your business. So everything has a silver lining. Hope you are able to capture that business with sales in a brokerage. Again, I'm going back to beat that dead horse is you need to have a sales brokerage in your umbrella of services that you can offer your clients. So until next time, thanks for listening and we'll see you at the next Property Management Mastermind Conference, which, by the way, I should announce that Premium Con 2023 is going on in Nashville, March 29, 3031, 2023, the Hyatt Regency, Nashville 2 to 3 minute walk from the Music Row right there on Broadway. It's going to be a fantastic event. Two days, two and a half days of conferencing. March 29, 3031 at Nashville at the Hyatt Regency. We look forward to seeing you there. And thanks for listening.

ANNCR: Enterprise Bank and trust the bank you all formerly knew as Sea Coast Commerce Bank with the same team, the same benefits, and an expanded and improved product suite. Enterprise Bank and Trust specializes in trust accounts and business banking for property managers. One of their best features is a cash analysis program where they can assist in paying your property management related invoices. Contact Alison at 6199886708 to learn more. This has been a podcast episode by Property Management Productions. Be sure to subscribe to our podcast. Leave us feedback and come back for our next episode.

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About The Host

The Host of this Podcast is Brad Larsen from San Antonio, Texas. Brad is the founder and owner of RentWerx, one of the fastest growing residential Property Management companies in Texas that currently manages over 700 single family homes.